Cowart's Common Room
Ebay again - Paypal this time

Just in case you are interested - in the other issue the NZ bidder backed down and has dropped the matter.

This is a different case:

I sold a set of bout 5 or 6 Judy Blume books to someone for about 16. Sent them off, thought no more about it. 3 weeks after I sent them the buyer messaged me to say when are they coming? I said I'd sent them off a day after payment and got the proof of posting to say so and queried that they should wait so long before contacting me. I agreed to send this to them, but in the end sent a copy so I would have the original if there was any claim. Deathly silence for a week or so, and now they have opened a claim with Paypal.

I have responded to Paypal as requested but as I have no tracking number as it was just ordinary mail, I get the feeling that the buyer will get a refund and the money will just be taken out of my paypal account and given to them! I don't know this for sure yet, but paypal have put a stop on the amount i.e. I can't spend it if I wanted to.

Now 16 here or there doesnt make that much difference to me but it is the principle of the thing. If it goes in their favour it sbows that anyone can claim they didnt receive a parcel - even if they did - and get their money back, if they paid by paypal.

Has anyone any experience of this? What do you sellers like Toady and Pipany think?


Posted at 27th Mar 2009 - 08:25AM   Posted by Faith   Ebay again - Paypal this time Comments: 17

Wizzard's Avatar you should be covered under seller protection with Paypal as you have proof of posting.

fingers crossed

Posted by: Wizzard on 27th Mar 2009 at 08:30AM

Toady's Avatar There's not a lot you can do as far as Paypal is concerned because they always protect the buyer but get a claim form from the post office and fill it out to get the compo. Lot's of ebay listings now say that the seller cannot be held responsible for the parcel once you have posted it. The only way round this is only to offer 'signed for' postal services, but this often puts buyers off because it's so much dearer.

Posted by: Toady on 27th Mar 2009 at 08:33AM

I don't know anything of eBay (as I may have said earlier) but as long as you have a proof of posting from the Post Office, your items are covered up to the value of 36.00 (I think that is the ammount) and this is for regular, First Class, uninsured postage. Sometimes they don't actually refund in cash, my cousins, for instance, recieved postage stamps to the value of the claim, but that is better than nothing.

Posted by: Celtic Heart on 27th Mar 2009 at 08:46AM

Faith's Avatar My listings say I cannot be responsible for the parcel once I've posted it too, Toady, but basically that's just words isnt it? I did think of only offering signed for, but I tend to sell lots of things, cheaply, and obviously people don't want to pay hefty postage on a cheap item as you say. I suppose I could say that if an item bids up to, say, 10 or over then I will only send it 'signed for'. What do you think?

Thanks CH, I might go to the post office and see what joy I get.

Wizzard, I'm not sure but I think they will only accept it as proof of posting if you have an item that is trackable.

Posted by: Faith on 27th Mar 2009 at 08:59AM

Toady's Avatar As I said in the pm you get a form from the PO. They will want the original Prrof of posting and some evidence of value so a copy of the Ebay invoice. I think when I claimed they took about a month to sort it but it was a parcel to S. Ireland. Got a cheque for the value of the item and postage refunded.

Posted by: Toady on 27th Mar 2009 at 09:05AM

Crystal Jigsaw's Avatar Personally, I think it's disgusting that buyers do this sort of thing and we all know it goes on, esp on a site like Ebay. You sell something in good faith and get poo-ed on from a great height. I'm not surprised the world is going down the tubes.

Hope it works out for you, Faith.
CJ xx

Posted by: Crystal Jigsaw on 27th Mar 2009 at 09:05AM

Preseli Mags's Avatar I had a similar thing happen to me. I had proof of posting etc, but the buyer was adamant the parcel had not arrived. They had already provided me with a different address to send it too as well, so I was a little suspicious. Miraculously, after a month or so, the parcel "turned up". Fingers crossed that this happens in your case. It does bother me that anyone can claim that a parcel has not arrived and then get a refund. You can get proof of postage, but how do you prove that a parcel has not arrived?

Posted by: Preseli Mags on 27th Mar 2009 at 09:06AM

Faith's Avatar Oh thanks Toady, sorry havent read your PM yet. I will do what you say and let you all know the outcome.

It is disgusting CJ but I suppose I have had over 500 transactions on ebay - mainly selling - and have only had a handful of unpleasant incidents - and this is the first claim.

Posted by: Faith on 27th Mar 2009 at 09:44AM

Toady's Avatar I don't think that you'd get away with claiming for non arrival more than once with Paypal. They are always on the look out for that kind of thing.

Posted by: Toady on 27th Mar 2009 at 09:49AM

Westerwitch's Avatar Yup Toady is right re getting the form from the post office - I recently managed to claim 34 from the PO on ordinary postage for things that didn't arrive - I did a post on it in the Common Room.

Posted by: Westerwitch on 27th Mar 2009 at 09:56AM

KittyB's Avatar Faith - the following is cut and pasted from an email I've just received from Paypal, by coincidence:

Selling on eBay can be really rewarding, but do you ever worry that a buyer might not receive the goods and could make a claim against you? Imagine losing out on your money as well as the item you thought you'd sold!

The good news is there's an easy way to protect yourself when you get paid with PayPal. Just follow these simple steps and you're automatically covered* by PayPal Seller Protection:

1. Send your items by registered post within 7 days.
2. Get signed proof of delivery for anything over 150.
3. Always post to the buyer's registered PayPal address.

Just make the steps below part of your eBay 'to do' list when you're selling, so you know you're covered. This way you won't be out of pocket and you can sell with confidence knowing that you have PayPal Seller Protection as an extra safety net.

* Please see the User Agreement for full terms and exclusions.

Posted by: KittyB on 27th Mar 2009 at 11:02AM

Faith's Avatar I've been to the P.O. and got the form.

Thanks Kitty, they emailed that to me too just now!

Posted by: Faith on 27th Mar 2009 at 11:11AM

Toady's Avatar Kitty beat me to it, I've just got the same email!

Posted by: Toady on 27th Mar 2009 at 11:24AM

Pipany's Avatar Hope it all gets sorted Faith. I have only bought from ebay with no problems so far, but never sold anything as my own website is enough for me to cope with! Rolling Eyes
Good luck x

Posted by: Pipany on 27th Mar 2009 at 12:50PM

Faith's Avatar Yes but Pipany is someone pays with Paypal, like I did when I last bought from you, and then says the parcel didnt arrive, Paypal will probably take the money from your account!

Posted by: Faith on 27th Mar 2009 at 01:14PM

Pipany's Avatar Oh I see why you asked me now...durr Embarassed
Yes, I realise this, but like you i don't want to add registered post to hte cost of the goods. I have already dropped postal costs from my site as it is, but will only send as registered if requested, so it is a risk I run I suppose.

Posted by: Pipany on 27th Mar 2009 at 01:55PM

Annakarenin's Avatar From a buyers perspective I would say that a delay of three weeks in querying is not unacceptable but rather accomodating. Some sellers are slow in getting parcels sent and often if I am busy I will take a while to realise something hasn't arrived.

I had to use tribunal for a non-delivery but the seller, unlike you Faith, wouldn't answer my emails and eventually I complained. I also checked her feedback and I wasn't the ony one not receiving items (a couple of brave souls who were obviously not adverse to receiving retaliatory negative feedback had braved being honest).

Unfortuantely it is you that has to make the claim to the post office Faith as you sent the parcel the contract lies with you not the seller. So proof of posting doesn't really help as a buyer.

Your buyer should have remained courtious and asked you to do this not gone straight to tribunal. I believe they do check all the correspondance during the tribunal so will be aware that the buyer acted hastely but that said the person may well be acting honestly as I was.

Posted by: Annakarenin on 28th Mar 2009 at 09:49AM

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